We first saw Stephen Wilson Jr supporting Brothers Osborne on their UK tour in 2022. (Read our review of that show right here) The thought, power and intelligence behind his music made a big impression. We described his music as sitting at the intersection where Nirvana meets Johnny Cash meets The Cadillac 3. Our first interview with him (here) saw us go deep into his history as a child boxing champion and guitarist for Indie rockers AutoVaughn. We also talked about his marriage to Leigh Nash, lead singer for Sixpence None the Richer.
Our second interview last year focused on his ‘bon aqua’ EP and his return to the UK to play The Highways festival (here) but even since then, his star rose in a seriously steep ascendency with the release of his debut album, ‘søn of dad,’ an album that ended up on virtually every platform’s ‘Best of 2023’ lists.
Wilson returned to the UK to play the CMA Songwriters show at the C2C festival earlier in the month, where his brand of humour, self-deprecation and heartfelt emotions were the highlight of the evening. We sat down with him before that show to talk about what a terrific year he had in 2023 and what is to come for the rest of this one.
It’s great to talk to you again, Stephen, and have you back over here in the UK.
It’s great to be back – I’ll be over here a good few times this year. Y’all are going to be sick of me by Christmas!
Did you perceive that you would come to have such a strong relationship with your European fans when you first started this journey?
No. I wasn’t sure how the relationship would develop but at the same time I am not entirely surprised because I have a bit more of an Indie Rock background, which, obviously, is very popular over here. Kinda where I come is not as foreign in Europe as it is, perhaps, where I come from.
Brothers Osborne asked me to come over in 2022 and I had one song out. I didn’t have a manager, an agent or a label – I had nothing – so I had no clue what I was getting into! When I first started playing for people in the States I could see that people in the crowd were a little unsure but when I played here, from the first song, every body just seemed to get it. I didn’t have to explain myself so much. I think people in the States are just starting to get it now and hopefully the album has done a lot of the explaining for me.
Do you think that it helps that artists like The Cadillac Three, Whiskey Myers, even Jelly Roll are changing the boundaries and blurring the lines between Country and Rock now?
Even artists like Tyler Childers and Zach Bryan are opening doors as well. It all helps to stretch the membrane of what is considered Country music to where artists like me have now have a spot also, compared to what it would have been like 10 years ago.
I’m a country singer and songwriter – it’s what I consider myself to be – but I’m not going to sit around and have that subjective argument with someone about it. I know that I write and sing Country songs. It’s something I’ve always wanted to be: a Country artist rather than an Americana artist or some other genre or definition, even though I’ve had a lot of people tell me otherwise.
It’s been a hectic couple of years for you. Has it passed in a blur or have you been able to stand back a little sometimes and appreciate the milestones?
Both! Mostly it’s probably passed in a blur but I have been trying to take it all in. It’s been a lot! (laughing) There have been a lot of milestones that have blown my mind because I am not supposed to be here! At this point I don’t question it, I just let it happen, observe it and move onto the next thing. It’s been a crazy blessing that I am really grateful for.
In the weirdest way, I come from a kinda Pentecostal / Nazarene background and then I chased the science degree to get as far away from that as possible but now I find myself, ironically, back in a kind of ministerial position in the oddest way possible. I have a lot of people crying at my shows and a lot of very emotional responses – you know, it’s not lighters in the air at one of my shows, right?
What a behemoth of an album ‘søn of dad’ proved to be. It was on everybody’s ‘Best Of’ lists at the end of last year. Has that surprised you and your metric of what success for this album means?
I didn’t expect that at all. That blew my mind as I didn’t really have any expectations for the album. Each of the songs on there are just gifts to me, they helped me get through so much. All I did was really just give the songs away to other people and not hoard them to myself. I appreciate the plaudits but these songs are bigger than me and I’m humbled by all the attention the album has received.
Does the intensity of the songs and the emotional weight of them take a toll on you when you are singing them live, night after night?
It takes a toll on me, I’m human, just like everybody else and there will be times when I breakdown in the middle of a song on a particular night. It’s all part of it. I’m not looking to do that but sometimes it’s unavoidable – it happened just a few days ago in Berlin, actually.
But, if you’ve come on board with me and listened to the album, you might not be surprised and it’s kinda all part of the process and package, maybe. The weight and the magnitude of the songs means that no-one seems to be surprised when it happens! I’m not fighting it anymore or apologising for having feelings, feelings are what created all this in the first place.
I try to stay present in each show and if those emotions show up, they show up, right?
That mid-album run of ‘father’s søn’, ‘grief is only love’ and ‘hang in there’ seems to be where the beating heart of all the emotion sits on the album. I’m always fascinated by how artists sequence their albums and at 22 tracks you had a tough job!
That’s the middle and the heart of the album so those songs had to be the foundation and the anchor for the whole record. By the time you get to those songs, you’ve kinda been through some things to prepare you and then those three songs hit before you start to climb out again.
I started writing and making this record pretty much the second after my dad died, whether I knew that I was doing it or not, I started keeping records of my feelings and emotions. When you get to the middle of the album, that’s where I was, right in the middle of the fire. It was very intentional to group them all together. The early songs that I wrote make up the initial part of the album then the songs that came later are in the latter part of the record – it’s not an exact chronological journey, but it’s pretty close.
My dad is subconsciously anchored in all of it – even the love songs. There’s a song called ‘not letting go’ which is about him and his experience. There’s a song called ‘henry’ which is about him being an incredible step-father – he’s anchored in that as well even though the song is really about my relationship with my step-son. He taught me me how to be a step-dad and he’s kinda there in so many different ways.
Does the magnitude and weight of this project make you feel at all intimidated to begin writing your next project in terms of feeling emotionally exhausted or have you still got lots more to say?
No, I’ve already written, probably most, of my next record. I’m still just keeping a record of what’s happening to me and what feelings I’m experiencing in my life. It feels like a bit of a ‘to be continued’ kind of project right now. Sometimes ‘chapter 2’ can be a completely different feel to chapter 1 depending on what kind of story or literature you are reading but my chapter 2 will be more of a continuation – the story is not over yet.
The book has to continue on, right? Perhaps there will be some different sonic themes in chapter 2 but really I’m just trying to stay true to the process that created the first record. I’m sure other songs will pop up as we work on the record, that’s what happened the first time around when I thought I was finished at 20 songs and then there was 21 and then there was 22! I finally knew when it was done and I’m sure I’ll feel the same this time around. I’m not saying I’m going to make another double album but I have a pretty clear path of where the story has gone so far although I’m not sure where it will finish. The windshield is bigger than the rearview, for sure!
You’re also writing for more and more other artists. I saw on Miranda Lambert’s socials that you had written with her and Ashley Monroe – what was that session like?
It was great! We’ve written 3 or 4 songs together now in the past few months…….
Is that for her or for you?
For her, I think. At the same time we’re not super precious about who they are for but it’s the feeling I kinda get with them. I’m such a fan of hers musically and personally, she’s such an incredible human and I’ve got to learn a lot by working with her. I’m pretty new to a lot of this stuff and am still learning how to be an artist and a better writer and working with someone like Miranda is such a learning lesson for me.
I’m very comfortable in that role as co-writer rather than artist, it was what I thought I would do after I quit my science job – I never thought that I would be the artist or the one out front singing the songs. I love to go into rooms with like-minded and authentic artists and try and say something different or impactful that inspires the people in the room to create a song. We’ve written some very true songs with Miranda and Ashley – we’re not really trying to write just anything, we want to write something real and I’m learning something about me all the time by doing that as well.
